<OscarL>
Habbie: "jam -q <bin>i2c" is the command you're after.
<OscarL>
if just calling "jam" from inside src/bin/i2c worked for you... it was because you only had that target to build again.
<OscarL>
AFAIK, jam always needs either a specific target, or it builds them all (if it hasn't already)
<OscarL>
Habbie: safest bet... just open the nearest Jamfile to the target you're trying to build, and you're most likely to find the correct target name to use ("<bin>i2c" in this case)
<OscarL>
(plain "jam i2c" would build the i2c bus manager kernel addon)
<OscarL>
(as can be seen by opening src/add-ons/kernel/bus_managers/i2c/Jamfile)
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<nekobot>
• Begasus (126081dc): kapman, bump to 25.04.0 (#12395)
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<nephele>
Begasus[m]: around?
<Begasus[m]>
yeah nephele
<Begasus[m]>
what's up with qmplay2?
<nephele>
Begasus[m]: borked icon theme for qmplay2 is because "Breeze" icon theme is selected in qt6 preferences instead of haiku. maybe some update broke that
<nephele>
if you set the iconset back to haiku it looks properly again
<nephele>
Anyhow, I wanted to ask you something else :)
<Begasus[m]>
I'll have a look at that later, didn't see a change for that here :)
<nephele>
I got it to compile (outside haikuports) but the install folders are a mess, and i didn't manage to get the localization to work. I need it in german, but all the buttons have generic "internal" names.... like "Menu::Item::Quit" or stuff like that
<Begasus[m]>
will have a look
<Begasus[m]>
bugger repology still down :/
<Begasus[m]>
bah, SF :)
<Begasus[m]>
already first error, needs sound package?
<Begasus[m]>
freealut_devel*
<nephele>
well, as i said, i got it to compile, and i did not need stuff not in haikuports :)
<nephele>
installing it is a different maneer, it wants wierd stuff for the documentation generation
<Begasus[m]>
why can't the use PREFIX= in there :)
<Begasus[m]>
DESTDIR should work
<Begasus[m]>
still building atm
<Begasus[m]>
in QMplay2 I see you can change "style" and Haiku style is in there, switching to Fusion/Windows works, but looks weird
<Begasus[m]>
biab, dogs :)
<nephele>
there is a Makefile.install.directories file, and the first line can be edited for the prefic stuff
<nephele>
but i don't quite understand how this works, or where it will look for it's data files
<nephele>
if you can figure that out, i could probably make you a patch so it uses find_dir for finding it's data dir or something
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<nekobot>
• Begasus (e0552fc6): granatier, bump to 25.04.0 (#12396)
<Begasus[m]>
ah ok, that relative is running this on Haiku I presume?
<nephele>
Ideally, yeah
<nephele>
It's a "new" computer i got for free, and their laptop is "old and slow" ... a.k.a completely sufficient but slowed down by windows...
<Begasus[m]>
getting lot's of these errors: icons.cpp:843:39: error: call of overloaded 'load_from_file_or_construct(<brace-enclosed initializer list>, <brace-enclosed initializer list>)' is ambiguous
<nephele>
ah, yes i did change something there
<nephele>
which file is it? i can upload the changed version
<Begasus[m]>
sec, just cleaned while playing around :)
<nephele>
Begasus[m]: as i said, i already got some of it to work. But not interested in monkey patching it :D
<nephele>
hence I turned to you
<nephele>
anyway, If there is some patches to be made to where it looks for the data for example i could do that
<Begasus[m]>
src/misc/preferences.cpp?
<nephele>
should i patch the set_data_directories ?
<Begasus[m]>
try grepping for "share/games"
<Begasus[m]>
that's the only one showing up for it (beside the makefile)
<Begasus[m]>
without being able to test it I would check there first yes
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<Begasus[m]>
Hola OscarL
<nephele>
the app crashed without getting the data files properly
<OscarL>
Hi Begasus[m].
<nephele>
maybe you can make the port to where it compiles and then i can try my hand at getting it to find the data files? :=
<Begasus[m]>
no output in Terminal?
<Begasus[m]>
heh, those errors are out of my scope/skills :)
<nephele>
what errors?
<Begasus[m]>
build errors
<nephele>
yes, what errors? :=
<OscarL>
the errors during build, duh! :-P /me ducks
<Begasus[m]>
mentioned earlier, in icons.cpp
<Begasus[m]>
* getting lot's of these errors: icons.cpp:843:39: error: call of overloaded 'load_from_file_or_construct(<brace-enclosed initializer list>, <brace-enclosed initializer list>)' is ambiguous
<nephele>
i already uploaded the patched file?
<Begasus[m]>
err where? maybe that was you crashing my quaternion then ;)
<Begasus>
/boot/system/develop/tools/bin/../lib/gcc/x86_64-unknown-haiku/13.3.0/../../../../x86_64-unknown-haiku/bin/ld: cannot find -lstdc++fs: No such file or directory
<nephele>
I removed the "fs" part from the line that links it
<Begasus>
thought so, just need to find that line ;)
<Begasus>
where do they set those LIBS that are needed, always doing the hard way ...
<Begasus>
got it
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<Begasus>
a2x: ERROR: "w3m" -dump -cols 70 -T text/html -no-graph "/Opslag/wip/FreeDoko_0.8.1/doc/de/LiesMich.text.html" > "/Opslag/wip/FreeDoko_0.8.1/doc/de/LiesMich.text" returned non-zero exit status 127
<Begasus>
got that also nephele?
<Begasus>
related to building the documentation
<nephele>
yeah I have no clue
<nephele>
As i said, got the build working, but not the docs
<nephele>
and don't know how to get it to stop building docs
<Begasus>
manpage: echo "Aktualisiere die man-Page"
<Begasus>
/Opslag/wip/FreeDoko_0.8.1/doc/de> a2x -f text LiesMich.adoc && mv LiesMich.text LiesMich.txt
<Begasus>
a2x: ERROR: "w3m" -dump -cols 70 -T text/html -no-graph "/Opslag/wip/FreeDoko_0.8.1/doc/de/LiesMich.text.html" > "/Opslag/wip/FreeDoko_0.8.1/doc/de/LiesMich.text" returned non-zero exit status 127
<Begasus>
doesn't even work when running this manually
<Begasus>
freaking weirdos (sorry for the wording)
<Begasus>
why add a doc target for make and not use it, but force it on make install??
<nephele>
I don't know begasus
<nephele>
can we remove it for make install?
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<Begasus>
just nuked it in the Makefile, no need for now
<Begasus>
no luck in launching either so far
<nephele>
does it give some error about not finding some card?
<Begasus>
Error loading the logo: Couldn’t recognize the image file format for file “/Opslag/wip/FreeDoko_0.8.1/src/logo.png”
<Begasus>
when launched from within the src directory
<Begasus>
Error loading the logo: Couldn’t recognize the image file format for file “/boot/home/config/non-packaged/share/games/FreeDoko/logo.png”
<nephele>
Begasus: it doesn't run from the source dir
<nephele>
Hence i ment, when you have finished packaging it (with data in "proper" locations) I would take your recipe and try patching it to find the data properly on Haiku :)
<Begasus>
without it launching one way or another it doesn't make any sense in trying to package it :)
<Begasus>
there is this thing with GTK and mime directory, need to check another GTK app to be sure it's not that
<nephele>
Yes it does, how am i supposed to fix it when installed via a recipe without the recipe? :/
<nephele>
if it launches and gives you faults about not finding some stuff that is enough and i can then make a patch to make it look in the proper dir
<Begasus>
whoot
<Begasus>
my new shared_mime_info package was the prob here :)
<Begasus>
now figuring out what it needs from libraries for the recipe ....
<Habbie>
waddlesplash, fun random fact - the freebsd bootloader appears to use textmode just fine on the chromebook. it might not be in protected mode though
<Habbie>
waddlesplash, right. that dies just after loading the kernel :D
<Habbie>
.. or perhaps this is also some framebuffer thing
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<Begasus>
nephele, don't have your email address to fill in the Co-authored-by part of the patchset :)
<Begasus>
or I could use it to set the author of the patchset (eg not me) :)
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<nephele>
doesn't matter to me. You can put "nep-haikuports@packageloss.eu" if you want
<Begasus>
okido, not there yet, food now, and still need to tackle the "install paths" part, but build is fine so far
<Habbie>
waddlesplash, ok, turns out freebsd, like haiku, -can- framebuffer these days (but on my system, did not)
<waddlesplash>
odd
<Habbie>
with the right boot flags it also reboots instead of hangs
<Habbie>
my only goal here was seeing if the touchpad worked in it, oh well
<Habbie>
not going to debug another OS loader today
<Habbie>
(or, debug my coreboot/seabios for another OS loader ;) )
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<OscarL>
Weee! finally got to add a simple file-extention/glob filter to TextSearch: https://0x0.st/8vpR.png
<Habbie>
nice
<OscarL>
from the previous "WIP" commit for this: "Date: Thu Mar 7 02:10:50 2024 -0300". Seems I tend to forget things in the back burner :-D
<nekobot>
• jackburton79 (8bcc9c59): BeScreenCapture: add new localizations to makefile (#12389)
<Habbie>
OscarL, lol. forgot about INTEL_PCH_DEVICE_ID_MASK. that's two wasted reboots ;)
<OscarL>
been there :-(
<Habbie>
i figured :D
<Begasus>
nice OscarL!
<OscarL>
thanks Begasus. Now only needs another year before I get it good enough for review :-P
<Begasus>
nephele, will push the recipe/patchset to codeberg in a bit, still need to launch in Terminal with (first): export FREEDOKO_DATA_DIRECTORY=/boot/system/data/games/FreeDoko/
<Habbie>
are you doing haikuports cooperation on codeberg?
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<Begasus>
so that data directory is not yet ok, probably set in the preferences.cpp file
<Begasus>
hmm ... in my lifetime OscarL? :P
<scanty>
hmmm... maybe i will release my nes emulator sometime in *my* life ^_^
<Habbie>
OscarL, SCREEN BRIGHTNESS CONTROL
<Habbie>
all the way down to complete invisibility
<OscarL>
nice!
<scanty>
also, hello!
<Habbie>
i would have had this an hour ago if it wasn't for that pesky mask ;)
<OscarL>
Habbie: same here for my GeminiLake machine :-D
<Begasus>
k, rizin not lost yet :)
<Habbie>
this is with CNP and KBYM, when i tried 'lower' combinations i messed up the mask, but this works
<Begasus>
Hi scanty!
<OscarL>
hello there scanty :-)
<Begasus>
grabbing freedoko-0.8.1-1-x86_64.hpkg and moving it to /Opslag/haikuports/packages/freedoko-0.8.1-1-x86_64.hpkg
<scanty>
what's new and exciting?
<Begasus>
so far so good :)
<zelectric>
give me a break give me a break break me off a piece of that KIT KAT BAR!
<scanty>
hmmm newest code not compiling here.... grr.
<Begasus>
broke it again scanty? ;)
* Begasus
ducks
<Begasus>
k, 3 more to go for gear 25.04, those will be for tomorrow :)
<scanty>
yeah, almost fixed.
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<Begasus[m]>
k, back in matrix for a bit, need to catch up here too :)
<scanty>
cool.
<scanty>
OK compling good now... had to disable sound.
<Habbie>
OscarL, bit of an open question: any idea why i don't see any "hda" in syslog while I do see my 5a98 ID in hda_controller.cpp?
<OscarL>
mmm HDA is *very* verbose, I'm surpriced you don't see any hda at all, regardless of hardware :-D
<OscarL>
*the "HDA" media addon and/or driver.
<Habbie>
yeah :)
<Habbie>
oh lol
<Habbie>
it is in the quirks table but not in the kSupportedDevices table
<Begasus[m]>
well, I know now the new shared_mime_info isn't compatible with current GTK apps :)
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<OscarL>
I thought I had broken my TextSearch while doing some minor clean up... turns out it just doesn't sets any "default target folder" unless you give them one on command line.
<Begasus[m]>
current directory?
<Habbie>
so uhm. what in haiku makes sound? :)
<OscarL>
Begasus[m]: currently, if you call it from Terminal you need to pass "." for that to work: "> generated/[...]/TextSearch ."
<OscarL>
Habbie: my pc_speaker driver :-P
<OscarL>
Habbie: /bin/beep, if you had a "Beep" sound setup for that event in Sounds.
<Habbie>
and as i ask this, -something- starts making a ringing sound on my debian
<Begasus[m]>
mind you habbie he doesn't have volume control on that yet ;)
<OscarL>
heh
<Habbie>
oh god it's a search tab with an accidental timer in it
<Habbie>
Begasus[m], i don't have volume control on my hda either!
<Habbie>
as for /bin/beep, to configure that, i also need an audiofile, right ;)
<OscarL>
yea, no default sound file in Haiku so far... there's have been some talks about it, even some proposed change in gerrit, IIRC.
<Habbie>
ack
<Habbie>
GNOME has buttons 'test left' 'test right', something like that would be cool
<OscarL>
repology's admins noticing 99.9% of request comming from Belgium... "mmm"
<Begasus[m]>
lol
<Begasus[m]>
OscarL I'm missing a package for ytmusicapi
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<OscarL>
I'm missing the love of my life... and 50K dollars. If only we could have everything we want, Begasus[m]... :-P
<OscarL>
"ytmusicapi-1.10.3-py3-none-any.whl"... let users "pip install" that thing! :-P
<Begasus[m]>
bugger ... can't compete there ....
<Begasus[m]>
already did, doesn't help with haikuporter :P
<OscarL>
Begasus[m]: some KDE app wants to use it?
<Begasus[m]>
yep
<Begasus[m]>
only something local I "had" running before
<Begasus[m]>
k, done for today
<Begasus[m]>
cu peeps!
<OscarL>
"It emulates YouTube Music web client requests using the user’s cookie data for authentication.", and isn't YT music a paid service?... not saying "don't do it", just seems pretty low impact.
<OscarL>
Later Begasus[m].
<Habbie>
i'd love a semi-native youtube music client once my audio works, fwiw ;)
<OscarL>
fwiw, a .recipe that just re-packages a pure-python .whl file is pretty straight-forward (I have a template somewhere).
<OscarL>
I just wish pkgman/packagekit had "optional" dependencies.
<OscarL>
(or "extras" as in Python's world)
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<PulkoMandy>
If it's optional it's not a dependency :)
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<PulkoMandy>
The idea sounds nice until you have to decide what to do with it, should the package manager install it? Then it's like a dependency, why make it different. Or should it not install it? Then why do you want to have a special field for it in the package metadata?
<Habbie>
debian's recommends/suggests are not terrible
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<PulkoMandy>
may be useful if the user interface tells you about them, but having my package manager tell me "hey, here are some more packages you might like" is disturbing to me. Maybe some people would like that
<Habbie>
in debian/ubuntu, it comes with a systemwide setting to decide which 'level' of bonus packages you want
<Habbie>
it makes sense for plugins/addons for things
<OscarL>
in python, you can for example install the base functionality with "pip install my_package" and extra stuff that is optiona with "pip my_package[foobar]"
<Habbie>
OscarL, oh right, that is decent stuff
<nephele>
i don't like recomends in debian
<nephele>
it's annoying to figute out later "oh you installed the wrong option"
<Habbie>
nephele, i'm torn on them - their usefulness also varies between packages
<Habbie>
yes
<OscarL>
why would I want to have foobar be a "hard" dependency?
<Habbie>
i think we might be having two conversations
<Habbie>
subpackages (optional) vs. suggests/recommends
<OscarL>
(I'd like to "pkgman install genio" without having to install a clangd, for example... as I may just want to use Genio for python stuff... why install clang in that case?)
<Habbie>
yes
<nephele>
that's a bit of a problem with such "mega" packages like genio that do everything
<nephele>
maybe genio should be able to just install deps on demand, or install it for itself so you don't even need it in the system
<Habbie>
indeed, genio is at the scale that you'd expect another package manager inside
<Habbie>
my linux editor (sublime text) offered to install clangd recently
<Habbie>
so i went "no stop i will apt-get it"
<nephele>
if it installs it (activates it) in it's own path there is no risk to the system, and it can do this without confirmation required
<OscarL>
a "pkgman extras/suggested <package>" that just lists suggested/extras package would be enough for me. So fare we have SUPPLEMENTS, that only gives me headaches regarding openssl3_man :-D
<OscarL>
given that your hardware is listed there, then open a ticket over https://dev.haiku-os.org/, Morgul. adding that info, and a syslog file.
<OscarL>
ah... it is NOT enabled, Morgul... notice that your device Id is inside an "#if 0 " block.
<Morgul>
does the syslog file clear after each reboot?
<Morgul>
oh, I see
<Habbie>
it does not clear after reboot but sometimes a chunk ends up in syslog.1
<Habbie>
(i was thinking just an hour ago that it would be nice to have a reliable way to get 'log since this boot')
<OscarL>
Habbie: I just "rm /var/log/syslog" and then reboot.
<Habbie>
clever
<Habbie>
70% of my boots are just after a fresh dd so i -usually- don't have the problem either ;)
<Morgul>
having the kernel write the boot date to syslog would be great
<OscarL>
Morgul: you mean as part of its filename?
<Habbie>
or as a line
<Morgul>
as a line
<OscarL>
I would pretty much like a single file per boot.
<OscarL>
this "append everything there till X file size then split" is not ideal, at least for me :-)
<Morgul>
I understand, but Linux does it that way also
<OscarL>
but, no idea how convoluted it would be to change that to a "per-boot" scheme, or if there's some rationale for current behaviour that I'm just not aware of.
<Morgul>
I guess all logs work simliarly, web servers, etc.
<Morgul>
so it's like a standard
<Habbie>
OscarL mentioned to me earlier that you can enable syslog timestamps
<OscarL>
by setting "syslog_time_stamps true" in "/boot/home/config/settings/kernel/drivers/kernel"
<Morgul>
I'll activate timestamps, it's a good idea
<OscarL>
Morgul: many of those graphics cards IDs where disabled because, IIRC, lots of ids where first added without much testing, and folks where having boot issues, thus prompting to disabling them again.
<Morgul>
does Haiku currently support mounting ntfs external USB 3.0 hard drives? I connected one, it detected it accordiing to syslog, but no new drive icon appeared on the desktop
<OscarL>
right-click on Desktop... Mount menu doesn't shows it?
<Morgul>
I see, OscarL. But I'd like to try on mine. It would be nice if it worked well
<Morgul>
ah, yes, it does, OscarL! I didn't know I had to find it there
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<OscarL>
Tracker has a "Disk Mount" preference, where you should be able to set auto-mount options. Not sure if that works for external volume/drives. I have it disabled on my installs.
<Hanicef[m]>
OscarL: afaik it does as long as you have it plugged in at boot
<Hanicef[m]>
might be wrong about that, though
<OscarL>
there's a different setting for moutning on boot (I use that to auto-mount just some partitions).
<OscarL>
not sure how they interact, though, haven't tested it extensively.
<Hanicef[m]>
ah, right, i know what you are talking about
<Hanicef[m]>
isn't there two settings for that? one that is just haiku partitions, and one that is all partitions
<Hanicef[m]>
now i wanna boot into haiku to check :|
<Morgul>
I'd rather not have it automount. But showing the drive icon on the deskptop, unmounted, so I can mount it from there
<Morgul>
if there's too many drive icons, having them inside a folder would be nice
<Morgul>
like My PC on Windows
<OscarL>
Morgul: if you want, I can compile a version of the radeon_hd driver with your card id enabled (in case you're not setup for doing it your self).
<Hanicef[m]>
same, i have it set to only mount the haiku filesystem on boot
<Hanicef[m]>
oh, yeah, speaking about radeon_hd, has anyone tested a radeon rx 6700 xt yet?
<Morgul>
oh, I'd love that, OscarL
<Hanicef[m]>
i saw it in the hardware list, but it seems like everything after vega is not functioning properly
<Habbie>
OscarL, that reminds me, i built my own hda earlier today, stuck it in non-packaged, syslog showed it loading, but it did not detect. then i blacklisted the real hda and rebooted and did it again. then it activated. that's the expected behaviour?
<OscarL>
Morgul: you can use "Show Disks icon" on Tracker's desktop preference, instead of it showing one icon per drive.
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<Morgul>
I'll look fot those settings, OscarL, not easy to find
<OscarL>
Morgul: from any Tracker window... on the menu... "Window->Preferences"
<Morgul>
oh, I see!
<OscarL>
or from Deskbar... Preferences->Tracker
<OscarL>
Habbie: not sure if "expected" behaviour... but a bit more common that it should.
<OscarL>
Habbie: you may add it to the "list of things to open a ticket about" :-)
<Habbie>
OscarL, because it should be checking the supported device table in my version / loading my version?
<OscarL>
Morgul: compiling with "{0x67ff, 11, 2, RADEON_POLARIS11, CHIP_STD, "Radeon RX 560"}" enabled... machine is slow, though (just like its owner)
<Habbie>
and it might have been loading the original one, triggered by me putting one in non-packaged?
<OscarL>
it should be loading from non-packaged first, I would expect.
<Habbie>
yeah
<Habbie>
i get the feeling it wasn't, -or- it was not using the ID table from it
<Habbie>
but that's all i know
<OscarL>
Morgul: https://0x0.st/8vOx.zip (file is a zip of "radeon_hd", had to zip it so 0x0.st would stop rejecting it)
<OscarL>
Morgul: you should be placing it under /boot/system/non-packaged/add-ons/kernel/drivers, and then creating a symlink to that file under /boot/system/non-packaged/add-ons/kernel/drivers/dev/graphics
<OscarL>
if re-booting fail... select "disable user addons" in the boot menu (and/or force the fail-safe display driver).
<OscarL>
you may want to disable the original radeon_hd from that boot menu too, Morgul, as mentioned by Habbie.
<OscarL>
in fact... I would recommend you to do that.
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<OscarL>
Morgul: alternative to disabling the radeon_hd from boot menu: copy the following file under /boot/system/ with the name "packages". https://0x0.st/8vO0.txt
<Habbie>
not /boot/system/settings/ ?
<OscarL>
sorry, yeah... that one.
<Habbie>
cool
<Morgul>
thank you, OscarL!
<OscarL>
no problem... let us know if it works at all :-)
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* OscarL
LOLs at the server name in Ellenor's join message: "vodafone-aotearoa.messed-me-up.umbrellix.net".
<Morgul>
Where is /boot on the UI?
<Ellenor>
it's historical cruft
<Morgul>
there's no settings folder on system/boot
<Morgul>
and system/settings seems to be something else, such as application settings
<Ellenor>
no, I mean my hstname is historical cruft
<OscarL>
Morgul: not sure how you have your Tracker setup. I always use it in "navigator" mode, and I can just enter a path in any window. You should be able to "open /boot/system/settings" from a Terminal window, for example.
<Morgul>
yes, I'm checking it now from the terminal
<Morgul>
so I should place it on /boot/system/non-packaged/add-ons/kernel/drivers right?
<OscarL>
the radeon_hd file, yes.
<OscarL>
errr. under /bin in that folder, sorry.
<Morgul>
ah
<OscarL>
"/boot/system/non-packaged/add-ons/kernel/drivers/bin/radeon_hd" full path.
<Morgul>
and where is the original one so I can delete it?
<OscarL>
"ln -sr /boot/system/non-packaged/add-ons/kernel/drivers/bin/radeon_hd /boot/system/non-packaged/add-ons/kernel/drivers/dev/grap hics/radeon_hd" to create the needed symlink.
<OscarL>
you can't delete the original file Morgul, thus why you either black-list it via the "packages" file....
<OscarL>
or you disable it via the boot-menu.
<Morgul>
okay, I'll try from the boot menu, I'll check how to open it
<OscarL>
Morgul: please note that the extra space in "grap hics" should not be there in the "ln -sr" command I suggested :-)
<Morgul>
I didn't have a graphics folder under /boot/system/non-packaged/add-ons/kernel/drivers/dev/ that dev folder is empty, I'll create it
<Morgul>
yes, I deleted that space
<OscarL>
yes, creating the folder is needed. sorry for not mentioning it. I already had that on my system.
<nephele>
Morgul: /system is the same path as /boot/system
<Morgul>
ah, thanks, nephele. I noticed it, but later on, not at first sight
<Morgul>
I'll try the driver by restarting now
<nephele>
The /boot is always the drive that was booted from. There is also an entry under the name of the drive (In my case Main, but it is often called Haiku)
<OscarL>
placing the "packages" file there might be easier than disabling via the boot menu (you'll need to navigate to "/system/add-ons/kernel/drivers/bin/" in there to disable radeon_hd).
<OscarL>
but getting used to navigating the boot menu ain't a bad skill to have for a hobby OS :-)
<Morgul>
I don't understand that thing about the packages file, sorry. I don't know what is that file
<Morgul>
but I saw the original driver on that folder, on /system/add-ons/kernel/drivers/bin/
<nephele>
It is a file named "packages"
<nephele>
You can list paths in it that the system will exclude from packages
<Morgul>
ah, I see
<nephele>
so you can tell it to exclude a path in the haiku package
<Morgul>
I'll try with the boot menu for now
<Morgul>
I'll brb
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<Habbie>
19:42Z <Morgul> I saw about the added support for Polaris Radeon video cards, and I wanted to try it, as I have and RX 550 or 560 (not sure which exactly)
<Habbie>
this
<Habbie>
the specific ID for Morgul's card was inside #if 0 with a beta5 comment
<Habbie>
so OscarL built without the #if 0 to try
<Habbie>
but with or without the #if 0, Morgul ended up with the vesa driver
<Habbie>
without the #if 0, with more logging first :)
<nephele>
these if 0 for beta5 are usually just broken, with the idea of "maybe" testing again in the nightlies
<Habbie>
i am noticing that there is some balance between "this driver lists 100 untested IDs" and "this other drivers lists 5 IDs that have been tested and adding more just make things work" ;)
<Morgul>
mine looked promising, you can see the syslog
<Morgul>
maybe I will open a ticket, yes, nephele
<nephele>
the syslog won't help me specifically, but if you are willing to test changes then opening a ticket, adding info from "listdev" and the syslog (with the info that you disabled the if 0) can get you further :)
<OscarL>
Habbie: the latter approach preffered by some devs, specially since the first tends to get lots of "his OS doesn't even boots!" complains :-)
<OscarL>
s/his/this/
<nephele>
Seeing as we have a really solid VESA and framebuffer driver adding more ideas "just to see" doesn't make much sense to me :)
<Habbie>
OscarL, yeah makes sense
<nephele>
on the other hand, i have two wacom devices here which want support aswell
<Habbie>
nephele, indeed. just on my system the bios vbe table was incomplete so i was motivated ;)
<nephele>
live patching didn't work for you Habbie?
<Habbie>
live patching what?
<nephele>
the bios
<Habbie>
didn't try that
<Habbie>
am i missing some easy trick you're thinking of?
<nephele>
PulkoMandy added code for that, basically since the bios vesa mode code is in a VM you can hack the modelines in it to add more, if you know the memory layout
<Habbie>
oh!
<OscarL>
"bios_patching true" in the "vesa" setting file. Not sure that would help in Habbie's case.
<Habbie>
i pondered recompiling the bios, the source is on github somewhere
<Habbie>
OscarL, plus set 'mode' to my own invention?
<OscarL>
"bios_patching true" already adds (tries too at least) some custom modes.
<PulkoMandy>
There is support only for some intel, nvidia and ati bios in the live bios patching code currently. But if you know the format used by seabios, it should be easy to add it to our code
<Habbie>
yeah i see just two 8086:x IDs
<Habbie>
oh wait. that's for 'enable by default' i guess
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<Habbie>
ok, might poke at that some day. or not
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<nephele>
PulkoMandy: do you have a specific design in mind how the windows would look in the deskbar mode?
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<PulkoMandy>
Only in my mind, and not sure I'll find time to draw some mockuhs (and then it may not look as good as I thought it would)
<Morgul>
I created the ticket with the information on my attempt to use the radeon_hd driver on my video card: https://dev.haiku-os.org/ticket/19578
<Morgul>
a suggestion for the Deskbar: make left click raise the window at least if ther's only one of that kind. It makes no sense to have both left and right click on an application entry to open the context menu, and none opening the window
<OscarL>
Morgul: better to attach the syslog file directly.
<Morgul>
I refer that it should do that independently of the position. It's a UX design flaw in all cases
<Morgul>
of course if you put it below or above, similar as on Windows OS, one would expect that behaviour on a left click, or at least on a right click
<Morgul>
but when it's on the side, as I prefer because the screen has more horizontal space than vertical, it should do the same thing as well. One of the mouse buttons should bring the chosen application to the front
<Morgul>
okay, I just saw that it's the middle button that does it
<OscarL>
One man's UX design flaw is another man "one true way" I'm afraid (as you can read on the linked discussion).
<Morgul>
then it's acceptable. Except maybe for laptops without a third mouse button
<Morgul>
having both main mouse buttons do the same thing is not very smart. It might be for backwards compatibility, I understand, but it's not good UX design
<Morgul>
by default it shouldn't be that way unless if you really need the backwards compatibility
<Morgul>
in my opinion, of course
<OscarL>
I would prefer the "one click toggles visibility for apps with only one window", mind you. There are some historical context at play too.
<Morgul>
yes, and it's that it was done for the middle button click. At least that's as quick as the other options when using an external mouse
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<Morgul>
it's that what* was done for the middle mouse button (it opens the window at least if only one)
<Morgul>
so someone thought that was important
<Morgul>
and it is
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<Habbie>
is anyone aware of an i2c tool that can send specific commands of my choosing?
<OscarL>
(since mouse wheel "replaced" 3rd button, never had a mouse where 3rd button was comfortable enough for me to use regularly)
<OscarL>
Morgul: now use Deskbar in "mini mode" like this: https://0x0.st/8vpR.png, so I don't get triggered by the lack of one-click toggle behaviour :-P
<OscarL>
Habbie: no, but sounds like it could be fun to add to /bin/poke.
<Habbie>
oh checking. my plan was to extend /bin/i2c
<OscarL>
not yet. never got around to test it enough on 64 bits (or for the rest of Haiku changes since I wrote it)
<Habbie>
so here's a fun story
<Habbie>
just 20 minutes ago I thought "maybe i can just port the Bus Pirate CLI to Haiku"
<Habbie>
but poke is pretty much that
<Morgul>
OscarL did you try opening your link? at least on WebPositive because of that comma in the end it failts. Not sure if it's an error on WebPositive or on that website
<Habbie>
the comma is not part of it
<OscarL>
Morgul: your IRC client needs better URL parsing :-)
<Habbie>
in what app are you chatting?
<Morgul>
it's Vision
<Habbie>
hmm. works with the , here actually
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<Habbie>
oh wait what. that opens something else
<Habbie>
OscarL, haiku terminal also includes the ,
<Morgul>
I think the issue is with WebPositive, opening a URL ending with a comma makes it fail
<bjorkintosh>
well, let's figure out why it's doing that.
<bjorkintosh>
that may be an unnecessary annoyance.
<OscarL>
I may have edited Genio.settings via kottan.
<Habbie>
workspace.settings
<Habbie>
OscarL, oh good to know
<bjorkintosh>
*cough* emacs is nice too *cough*
<Habbie>
aaand Genio crashed
<Habbie>
right click, Esc -> crash
<OscarL>
(now that I opened workspace.settings with kottan... yeah, that one contains "active_project" and "project_to_reopen")
<Habbie>
indeed
<Habbie>
i saw enough with 'cat' and did rm
<bjorkintosh>
under Genio -> Settings -> General -> Startup, isn't there something to turn off, Habbie?
<Habbie>
bjorkintosh, only if you can start Genio
<OscarL>
mtime: 10 of march... small miracle I even remember doing somthing with those files :-
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<bjorkintosh>
oh. purge and re-install then.
<Habbie>
no
<Habbie>
it's already sorted
<bjorkintosh>
it is?
<Habbie>
it is
<Habbie>
also do we even have purge?
<bjorkintosh>
you know, the action of getting rid of things.
<Habbie>
ok, in Debian that's an actual package manager (apt-get) command
<bjorkintosh>
yeah.
<bjorkintosh>
Habbie: so how did you fix your issue?
<Habbie>
rm workspace.settings
<bjorkintosh>
perfect.
<Habbie>
i did mention this twice in just the last five minutes
<bjorkintosh>
I was busy installing genio in proxmox
<bjorkintosh>
I apologize.
<Habbie>
no worries
<Morgul>
Habbie ah, I thought that too, that it could be a thing with that .st site
<Habbie>
OscarL, can i convince you to mirror poke to codeberg so you can take patches there? :)
<OscarL>
Habbie: we may have to open a ticket at Genio's tracker for false adverticement. "'the Haiku IDE' not so much!" :-P
<Habbie>
hehehe
<Habbie>
yes
<OscarL>
Habbie: sure thing! give me a minute.
<Habbie>
no rush
<Habbie>
i just started typing in the commands table
<Habbie>
no actual code yet ;)
<Habbie>
OscarL, sad news: 'beep' does nothing on this machine
<OscarL>
Haiku lacks a pc_speaker driver....
<Habbie>
oh, i assumed 'beep' did not need it
<Habbie>
i meant poke beep
<OscarL>
ah, poke's beep!
<Habbie>
confusion is mine, sorry :)
<nephele>
"The haiku IDE" kinda violates the haiku trademark already OscarL ;)
<OscarL>
if that doesn't works, then my pc_speaker driver won't either :-( Crappy new hardware! :-)
<Habbie>
uhuh
<OscarL>
I would frame it as the "slightly overly enthusiastic" IDE instead.
<OscarL>
Habbie: don't tell nephele that my /bin/poke already infringes TM too! ("#defineINTRO_STRING "\nWelcome to "HAIKU_COLOR_STRING"'s poke shell! (type 'help' if you need it)\n""
<Habbie>
:)
<nephele>
To me this is annoying only because it implies this is the only or best IDE for Haiku, when it isn't the only IDE .-.
<nephele>
Lol
<nephele>
The human interface guideline goes against deskbar kinda
<nephele>
"Don't Show a pop-up menu by clicking on a button or do other similar nonsensical control daisy-chaining."
<Morgul>
opening a popup menu on a right click button is standard
<nephele>
what is a right click button?
<Morgul>
on the left one nope, except in left handed settings
<nephele>
oh, you mean the mouse button
<Morgul>
yes, the mouse buttons
<nephele>
i was confused because the excerpt i copied deals with buttons as in the gui control
<Morgul>
yes, I didn't thnk about that ambiguity
<Morgul>
well, I'll go to sleep already
<Morgul>
I'm very glad to see Haiku gaining popularity little by little
<Morgul>
and the huge progress it's having
<nephele>
We should make another release at christimas, that seemed to get good press xD
<Morgul>
and there should be efforts to integrate all of the new features that brought people's attention: Wine, hardware acceleration
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<Morgul>
it doesn't matter if it doesn't do much, but whatever is done and worked should be integrated, not left as experiments
<nephele>
Morgul: that's on the person who designs that, it's annoying to have to pick up projects that are left in a badly maintained "hacky" state :)
<nephele>
also fwiw, it's annoying that it's only the useless kind of acceleration, the one only really good for 3d games... and not accelerated video decoding ;)
<Morgul>
well, you'll know better than me, but sometimes it's a matter of bureucracy too. If you leave all of that to the person who did it and that person doesn't have more time than what he/she already put
<Morgul>
if I bring you something, you use it, don't waste it
<Morgul>
don't make a newcomer to have to go through hard hops to have his contribution serve
<Morgul>
I kwow it's not the case with X512, but if you do the same for everyone, that's bad bureacracy on the project, in that sense that you prevent contributions
<nephele>
It's not a newcomer, and there is a lot of history involved ;) I wouldn't hold my breath for anything to get merged quickly.... for that it would first have to be submitted in the first place
* OscarL
submitted /bin/poke in 2005 by sending it via mail to AxelD... seems it landed in the spam folder :-D
<nephele>
Hmm, i forgot what poke does :)
<OscarL>
low level access to hardware, ISA, PCI, memory address.
<nephele>
ah, right. isn't that also in posix?
<OscarL>
was more useful "back then" I guess.
<Habbie>
i doubt it
* Habbie
pokes the bear
<OscarL>
nah, just something original BeOS had.
<Habbie>
well actually
* Habbie
bears the poke
<Habbie>
(bear -- make)
<Morgul>
I remember the case of a patch I made to improve some translations on the git project, I only wanted to contribute the translations passing it to the team, and I was received by bureaucracy: oh, your patch (which was very small) should be broken into several ones, and some of the translation cannot be what you did. And that's it, I had no more time to contribute, and my contribution was wasted
<nephele>
atleast on gerrit some devs will pick up and refactor submitted patches if they aren't updated for a long time
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<nephele>
but then gerrit also has a long backlog :/
<Morgul>
Compare that to a Portuguese guy who made a patch adding a Portuguese translation for a project I develope, for some reason his report was closed by another admin with won't fix because something else he said didn't make sense... what I did one year later is taking his translation into Portuguese, completing it, doing a commit from it, and give him credit as if it was all his work
<Habbie>
if i find myself typing #include <private/i2c/i2c.h>, does the 'private' suggest i'm doing something wrong?
<nephele>
depends on context Habbie
<Habbie>
nephele, working on /bin/poke
<nephele>
I think in that context you might not get around without using private headers, but keep in mind that this makes this a *lot* less portable between haiku versions
<Habbie>
incidentally i notice it also includes private/drivers/poke.h
<Habbie>
sure
<OscarL>
hey, at least the driver part did landed in Haiku :-D
<nephele>
basically, you can either use the public api: very portable, libshared: less portable, but statically compiled so no bigggy. Or system internals which can break between versions easily :)
<Morgul>
most people who ask for hardware acceleration don't seem to know why they're asking it, it seems to me, nephele. They think it's need because it's what they believe. They think the UI needs it, when it doesn't, and no amount of explaining will solve that. But implementing hardware acceleration, integrating it and announcing it does solve that issue
<nephele>
OscarL: honestly, I am wondering. It doesn't seem like a "good" idea to have such potentially destructive commands in the default install, but on the other hand this should be extremely usefull. I wonder how much overlap this has with KDL?
<nephele>
Morgul: yes, i suppose that's true. Same Issue with webrowsers :/ doesn't matter how good we make webpositive, firefox and then chrome always has "even better" :)
<OscarL>
Habbie: "my" poke was DOS/Win9x/(and for a short while WinXP before I lost that code)/BeOS/Haiku. But don't worry about portability, please :-)
<nephele>
now all these 'great' browsers are ported, and not one of them can print recipes
<Habbie>
i won't :)
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<Morgul>
people ask for it, then you do it. As long as it doesn't cause trouble, why not? you want hardware acceleration? we got hardware acceleration, there. And it doesn't matter how much it accelerates, it's news that will bring people in
<Morgul>
it doesn't matter if you do it for video, for the teapot app only, for the UI, for the framebuffer... you say you did add hardware acceleration and the news spreads
<nephele>
I get that, it's still sometimes a bit demotivating working on the native webrowser when the feedback is basically "this is crap, port this stuff from a company instead" :)
<OscarL>
nephele: we already have /dev/misc/poke and /dev/misc/mem. /bin/poke at best made it easier to shoot your self in the face :-P
<Morgul>
of course it's not ideal, but Microsoft uses that kind of marketing tricks a lot. And they super succeed no matter how poor their designs and software is
<nephele>
I think Haiku is on a good way
<Morgul>
so it's not all about good designs and engineering
<OscarL>
nephele: I don't expect it to have it as default tool, thus why I only uploaded it to GH after I found its sources again.
<Morgul>
marketing does really do a thing
<Morgul>
and doing the best product won't bring success
<nephele>
OscarL: We can, if wanted, add stuff to the tree (especialyl if it requires intenals to work), but put it in a seperate hpkg
<nephele>
like haiku_extras
<Morgul>
usually, unless if the marketing was good also
<Morgul>
mediocre with good marketing usually wins always
<nephele>
microsoft marketing currently wants to encourage the next wave of "throw your computer away"
<Habbie>
OscarL, i did an i2c poke!
<OscarL>
nephele: once I make sure it works again, specially if Habbie adds more features to it... I'd be glad if it was added to the main repo (even if "disabled"/"must compile on your own").
<Habbie>
pci and pcilist wor
<OscarL>
Habbie: nice!
<Habbie>
k
<Habbie>
and i2cget now also 40% works
<Habbie>
i did not touch the pci stuff, just tried it
<nephele>
OscarL: no objections from my side anyway
<nephele>
You know, i really would like some bot to try the tests we have in the tree, maybe make screenshots to compare :)
<Morgul>
I realize people who work on big projects like Haiku need to have a huge tolerance of opinions, pressure and BS of other people, to keep true to their vision. I really admire that
<Morgul>
because as you said it's very easy to be demotivated. You work with best intentions, and get criticized, as if you had limitless resources or needed to please everyone
<Morgul>
Microsoft seems to be shooting their foot, and it's very needed for people to wake up from their siren songs and try alternate OS
<Morgul>
I'll sleep now. Good night everyone!
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<nephele>
night
<nephele>
:)
<Habbie>
i'm having a conversation with an i2c device
<nephele>
don't trust that i2c device!
<Habbie>
it's not the i2c device i wanted to talk to
<Habbie>
but this one at least does not ghost me
<OscarL>
heh
<Habbie>
i2c branch on /Habbie/poke if you're interested
<Habbie>
will file a PR when it's cleaner
<OscarL>
there's something "magical" in being able to "talk" to hardware. Still remember the first time I was able to scan an i2c bus... find an EEPROM and a TV/FM tuner, and later on being able to dump the eeprom and program the tuner.
<OscarL>
thanks Habbie!
<Habbie>
yeah indeed, it's fun
<Habbie>
and as i mentioned before, i thought spending some time with haiku would get me -away- from hardware and i2c ;)
<nephele>
how so? :P
<Habbie>
i no longer think that
<Habbie>
i just.. thought that
<Habbie>
i am terrible at predicting things ;)
<nephele>
ah, i thought you ment you wanted some way away from hardware ;)
<Habbie>
nah, not 'wanted', but i like to switch sub-hobbies every once in a while
<Habbie>
i say 'sub' because so many things overlap
<nephele>
looked a bit into adding these two intuos tablets, but i don't wanna :)
<Habbie>
hmm?
<nephele>
So added a ticket
<nephele>
I have 4 wacom tablets here
<Habbie>
tablets as in, big touchpads?
<Habbie>
not 'full fledged devices with a touch screen'
<nephele>
No, with a pen, a drawing tablet
<nephele>
No screen
<Habbie>
ack
<Habbie>
incidentally Devices tells me there's a WCOM50C1 on one of my i2c busses
<Habbie>
what are yours? usb?
<nephele>
yes
<Habbie>
the good news is that they will at least show up, i guess ;)
<nephele>
2 are supported (bamboo) and two intuos are not supported
<Habbie>
ack
<Habbie>
i wonder if `poke` could grow a USB feature
<Habbie>
also i saw your question "how much does this overlap with KDL"
<Habbie>
and i like that i can 'poke' while the rest of the system also works
<Habbie>
also i have never managed to return from KDL to Haiku
<Habbie>
but i might be missing something
<nephele>
the command is "continue"
<nephele>
or "co"
<Habbie>
if you'll please remind me how i can start KDL now, I'll check if that was the missing info (because i don't think it was)
<nephele>
run "kernel_debugger" :)
<OscarL>
KDL pegs my PCU to 100% all the time, so /bin/poke is already more energy efficient :-P
<nephele>
or use the keyphrase i cannnnnnt remember
<Habbie>
my keyboard is useless
<Habbie>
kernel_debugger opens KDL
<nephele>
OscarL: i think that is intentional
<Habbie>
and 'continue' hangs Everything
<OscarL>
nephele: doubt it... it even calss cpu_pause()
<OscarL>
BeOS KDL on the other hand... just sips power :-)
<nephele>
well, it intttttttttttttttttttentionally is only on one thread