ChanServ changed the topic of #wayland to: https://wayland.freedesktop.org | Discussion about the Wayland protocol and its implementations, plus libinput
<aelius>
There's a gnome extension that does exactly that
<aelius>
Speaking of gnome- I've asked in their irc channel, (hopefully bridged to their active userbase...) but this might be answerable as a wayland related issue. Sometimes after cold boot, after logging into gdm, I cannot interact with the desktop. Mouse moves, but nothing is clickable. No reaction from keyboard either.
<aelius>
Yank power, cold boot again, and now it'll work just fine.
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<aelius>
I'm on debian trixie, and I do not know how to begin fixing this.
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<daniels>
aelius: it's very much an issue in GNOME's implementation, not Wayland in and of itself
<aelius>
Is it a known issue?
<aelius>
I don't know what to search for, if it's a "wait for a fix" thing, or if it's a "this only affwcts aelius and will never be fixed" thing.
<MrCooper>
if nobody reports it, you might have to wait a long time for a fix :)
<jadahl>
aelius: never heard of such a bug, better report it
<MrCooper>
there is at least one issue about freezes as of mutter 48
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<MrCooper>
aelius: FWIW, Ctrl-Alt-Fx might work to switch to a different VT, which should allow collecting logs and killing the frozen gnome-shell
<aelius>
That's actually one of my wayland problems... it seemed like that used to be a fundamental system shortcut back in the x11 days. Under wayland, if the wm/de isn't responding to input, you can't escape to a VT.
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<MrCooper>
that was working with at least some of the freezes with mutter 48, it sounds like your freeze might be lower level
<MrCooper>
do you have a second machine you can use for SSH'ing into the frozen one?
<llyyr>
if you don't have a second machine you can use your phone (termux)
<aelius>
Yeah. I get the distinct impression it's not frozen per se, though. I wonder if there's a seat or permission issue (I'm only vaguely familiar with such things).
<aelius>
But then again, on this machine I did notice gnome-shell using more resources than I think it should, so it could be related to my hardware and/or debian.
<aelius>
Debian because I'm new to debian, but also because debian doesn't seem to be particularly suited for having a newer nvidia GPU.
<aelius>
I'm also new to gnome... I was always a dwm user in x11 days, but I'm just... trying to make my life easier by going with the flow and using larger projects and more stable/established projects.
<aelius>
It's not going particularly great.
<Ermine>
debian is not well suited for a desktop due to packages getting outdated
<MrCooper>
aelius: are you using the nvidia drivers?
<kode54>
dammit
<aelius>
I was/am willing to buy into the debian mindset of slowing down the flow of package updates (with security fixes backported). But coming from arch, there are just way less packages in general, and they aren't always named in ways I can make sense of, and god pacman is so much better than apt/dpkg. I digress though.
<kode54>
latest chrome dev channel doesn't work on wlroots 0.20 because it's trying to use implicit INVALID dmabufs for the surfaces
<aelius>
MrCooper: I had to use nvidia upstream drivers, or have no drivers at all.
<MrCooper>
the drivers called "nvidia" aren't upstream
<kode54>
the correct takeaway is to never buy nvidia
<aelius>
Like I said, my card is too new for anything in debian's repos.
<JEEB>
nvidia has its fair share of issues, but you should always remember that KMS commit timeouts etc are a thing on other drivers as well.
<MrCooper>
ah, you mean "upstream" as in "directly from nvidia", we normally use that for drivers included in the Linux kernel / Mesa :)
<aelius>
gotcha
<aelius>
I'll probably go AMD next GPU. I have been using linux on my laptops, but never quite made the jump for my gaming pc. AMD is the second class citizen in Windows land. But now that EVGA is out of the game and MS is descending into madness, I'm making the effort to game on linux. Luckily it seems I've arrived just in time, having read about the recent resolutions of several more eggregious nvidia problems.
<aelius>
s/just in time/at a lucky time/
<JEEB>
I've been on AMD on a laptop for the past five years and if you follow stable linux kernels you can expect @amd.com commit to break something roughly... once per year?
<JEEB>
renoir had it more often the first two-three years, but I've not had it too bad afterwards
<JEEB>
it's still open source, of course. so those who have the time etc can bisect